Contracts for church gigs?

[David Ice]

Does anybody require contracts/deposits for church gigs? I’m really frustrated….a church that has used me for two years asked me to play for their huge Christmas extravaganza again this year, and required a commitment (including names and contact info for any subs!) as of last May. I just found out today that “the orchestrations are new and we don’t need you.”

As per their request, I had blocked out nearly 3 weeks in December for their rehearsals and performances since May.

I told them I had turned down at least 10 gigs (at least what I can document/verify) already. They finally agreed to pay me for the gigs I turned down…..but being paid for 10 gigs instead of 21 still bugs the daylights out of me.

A friend suggested that in the future I require a contract and 50% deposit for December church/orchestra/choral gigs. Does anybody else do this? My friend said, “treat any church or organization the same as a wedding, especially in December…and have a 50% cancellation penalty if they cancel less than 90 days in advance, 75% penalty if 60 days,, and 100% penalty if less than 30 days.”

Any thoughts/comments? They have been DEMANDING commitment and confirmations for me since May 11!

David Ice

[carl-swanson]

They demanded commitment from you, and you gave it to them. Now they owe you what you would have been paid if they had used you. Commitment runs in both directions!

[David Ice]

I feel that way too, but they sort of blind-sided me. In fact they called during a harp society meeting! But I am charging them for every rehearsal/concert I turned down. They even asked “can’t you just get the gig back?” I told them emphatically NO…it’s not fair to the other harpists or the conductor!

[carl-swanson]

David- They don’t owe you for the work you turned down. They owe you for the work they promised you and demanded you commit to.

[Angela Biggs]

David, your friend is absolutely right. And I agree with Carl about what they owe you. If it’s too late to insist on that now, okay, but — contracts forevermore. The only time I don’t require a contract is when I’m playing a Communion meditation for the church I attend (and I’m a cantor there, so I usually play when I’m already singing anyway). Every other church is subject to my standard business practices, for exactly this reason. Churches are just as likely as any other client to stiff you.

[jimmy-h]

Did they think at all?

Next season, when/if they want a harpist again, should be very interesting. “Once burned, twice shy” and all that. Any harpist in that area should be rather reserved about working with them after this.

Be careful about how they treat you if they pay you for those 10 gigs, they may come back and demand performance for their paying you. You’ve been treated poorly, careful they don’t drag you deeper into their mismanagement.

[tony-morosco]

Personally, in music as in the rest of my life, I try to avoid churches at all costs ;^)

That said, I see no reason not to treat a church just like any other organization. Business is business and a contract is always needed. It makes do difference what kind of organization is doing the business with you, treat them all the same.

[Gretchen Cover]

An oral contract is worth the paper it is written on – Louis B. Meyer.

It is unfortunate you are getting stiffed but as a former office manager, I don’t think you can do much except hope the church will actually pay you under the oral contract agreement. I guess the lesson learned here is that once someone insists on reserving you, have it in writing and with a deposit. You’d like to think you can do business with a former client on a handshake but…..

[David Ice]

Okay gang, here’s the latest: Out of the blue I got a form email asking me to “confirm” my participation in this year’s pageant! I emailed the music director and asked, basically, what was happening? I thought I was out. I got this in reply:

“Maybe call your friends from out of town, explain the situation, and see if you can get the gigs back.

You received the planning center email from April because you will need to download any harp music that we have and be prepared to play it with us on the dates you listed:
December 3,5,6,8,10,11,12,13,14,15.”

Now *I* am totally confused–suddenly I have all these dates to “confirm” but I was told there was no parts and I wasn’t needed?!?!

I emailed them back:
“Maybe I’ve slipped a gear somewhere, but I thought you said you DID NOT need me at all! I have all the dates open right now in December.

I haven’t booked anything yet, and I can’t really call the other harpists (I did not hire them, the orchestras/conductors did when I said I wasn’t available.) But I AM available every day in December.

Do you need harp for December 4,7,9?

I apologize if I misunderstood you, but I thought you had said you had no harp parts at all (new orchestrations) and my services weren’t needed at all. That’s why I’m very confused!”

The answers I get back are more cryptic than ever–apparently (and I have to read between the lines!) I am to play several dates unless I can get another gig. I think. I’ve shown the emails to several friends and they are all perplexed as well…..as one friend said, “I think they want you to get as many jobs as possible and just go away.”

I’ve never been in such a situation. As another friend said, “When IS a harp valid for orchestrations, especially in December? ” So I guess I will be doing SOME dates with them after all, but it would appear they will be sulking and very unhappy that they are paying me anything. I mean, asking me to call the other harpists and yank my gigs back from them?!?!? I would never do that in a million years!!!!

Dave Ice

[Gretchen Cover]

David,

Pick up the phone and call the person sending the emails. Get an explanation. Sometimes emails just don’t do the job of conveying a message. Then write what you hear and email it back. Get a deposit and contract.

Gretchen

[jimmy-h]

They sound very disorganized. Sounds like a disaster that’s on a slow burn. I agree with Gretchen that a phone call would probably help make sense of things. I hope you consider any further involvement carefully. It would suck to get involved again just to be ‘dismissed’ yet again before the events.

[carl-swanson]

David- You need to start communicating with these people in writing, either emails (that you save) or letters. That way you have a firm trail of communication that you can refer back to.

I think I would tell them(in a letter) that you have a long history of playing, and being available for this church year after year. Because of the confused messages that you have been getting from them, you want a response from them, in writing, that they either need you or they don’t. If they say they need you, then you need to get a non-refundable 50% deposit NOW to hold the dates they want. If they inform you, again, in writing, that they don’t need you at all, then you will plan your December bookings without them. If they come back later on and change their minds, you have this trail of correspondence to show them.

[Angela Biggs]

David, the first thing you need to do is place a phone call to the person in charge, probably the Music Director. Take notes on your computer while on the phone with him, then email him with the details of your conversation and request an immediate confirmation. From then on, communicate only in writing. Send them an extremely specific contract, get a sizable deposit, and set a hard deadline for it.

[David Ice]

I’d like to post an update and a request for feedback. The latest on this: I just got an email from the conductor asking me to confirm what dates I’d be playing with them. I sent them the dates. Then this morning I got the following email:

“I don’t remember it being that many performances. I would appreciate it if you would forward me our original correspondence regarding these dates.”

In other words, they DON’T BELEIVE ME when I sent a list and think I’m lying!
And their email with the dates was sent 6 weeks ago.

I’ve just about had it! It’s clear they DO NOT WANT ME THERE. Do I just soldier on and play the dates? I’d be nearly physically ill doing it….what a horrible space to be in, creating music where you are CLEARLY not wanted….or do I tell them that I will never darken their doors again and spread the word to the harp and orchestral community that this is how they treat people? They have at least a $200,000 budget for this production–it’s truly “Broadway Goes To Church” complete with flying angels, live animals, and a cast of 300 and a 35 piece orchestra. So $750 is NOT a budget breaker for them! I’m sure they spend that much just to rent the live python or kangaroo (which I never remember reading about in the Christmas Story…….but that’s another issue…..)

Any advice as to what to do? I’ve never been treated/insulted/had my honesty so questioned. I know if I tell them to stuff it–then they win and they don’t pay me. But I’m so angry now that I don’t know if I could even come up with a scale gliss without being filled with totally negative feelings. FEEDBACK PLEASE!!!!!

[kreig-kitts]

A python and a kangaroo: “Winnie the Pooh and Mowgli Save Christmas”!

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