CAMAC Ulysse, Excalibur and Celtic Isolde – SOUND and STRING TENSION

[Lily-White]

Hi,

I’m currently playing a rental Dusty Strings Ravenna 34. I love the sound of it, it’s both warm and bright. I don’t want to rent forever and have enjoyed myself a lot looking at and listening to different harps online! At the same time it can be quite overwhelming. I’m still a beginner and it’s difficult to compare the sounds of the harps with each other, especially as they have been recorded in different ways and places.

Strings that require “hard work” aren’t for my hands, because of health issues. I’m looking for something that’s light for the hands. At least 34 strings, preferably 36-38.

I like to play different kinds of music: Classical, contemporary and meditative. Not a lot of traditional music. 

I live in an apartment building and would prefer a harp that isn’t “louder” than my current Ravenna 34.

I have tried to compare the sound and the string tension of Camac’s ULYSSE, CELTIC ISOLDE and EXCALIBUR. But it’s hard for me. Is there someone out there who knows these harps and could enlighten me on this? 

–    The ULYSSE is a complete mystery to me. I don’t find opinions, reviews or similar about it online. It’s a concert harp, so it might be “loud”? It has “only” 34 strings and isn’t very high. On the other hand it’s very light and they make it in white – a white harp is my dream… 😀

–    I have read a lot of positive things about the EXCALIBUR, it has a “strong and beautiful sound”, which probably means “loud” in my case…  And I don’t know about its string tension in comparison with the other models. I LOVE the height of it though, I’m very tall.
 
–    The CELTIC ISOLDE: The word “Celtic” doesn’t necessarily go well together with the kind of music I play, but online I think it sounds SO beautiful… (?). It’s a student harp, so I don’t think it’s louder than my current Ravenna 34. I love the look of it and it’s pretty high as well. And it has 38 strings! It would be very interesting to know about its string tension and sound compared to my Ravenna…

A HUGE thank you if somebody has read this far! 😀  
I would be very grateful for any piece of information I could get.

Enjoy playing your harps! 🙂

– Lily

PS. Sorry about the word “loud”. It has nothing in common with the heavenly sound of a harp… <3

[balfour-knight]

Lily, I wish I could help you here, but I do not know very much about Camac lever harps. I only know that my Dusty Cherie (FH36S) has Camac levers, and that they are the best. I hope others here will see this thread and contribute to it!

Huge Harp Hugs back to you,
Balfour (and Carol Lynn)

[Blindharper]

Hi,
I have played the excalibur for the last eight years. I started on a dusty strings crescendo, so I know what sort of string tension you’re working with now. From a height perspective stick to the excalibur, from a weight perspective, if you need a lighter harp, and want to consider something with carbon fiber I would actually consider a heart made by heartland harps as their harps are completely made from carbon fiber, and generally less than 15 pounds for a lever harp. They are not cheap by any stretch, but they are well worth the money. to your questions about sound and a string tension… Do you want to be able to work with concert spacing or Celtic spacing. For clarification concert spacing is more standard for lever harps that work as bridges up to a pedal harp. A harp that carries the label of Celtic Has a slightly narrower string spacing. The sound is often slightly brighter, and I have often found that the playability tension is slightly lower as well. don’t be fooled by that label! You can play anything you want to on a Celtic style harp just as you can with a harp that carries the label of classic and has traditional concert spacing! if you like playing faster pieces of music, I would suggest the Celtic spacing, but to each their own. I don’t remember what the is older was strong with, but I do know the excalibur, and I believe the ulyss are both strung with fluorocarbon strings. In my opinion, Fluorocarbon is the best, but again, to each their own. I found that nylon strings, often rolled under my hands while playing which fluorocarbon has never done. Gut strings often carry too much tension from a playability perspective. They also tend to be the most expensive. The excalibur has a slightly wider soundboard than the Isolde, which in my experience, makes for a slightly more consistent range and sound quality. When I tried the Isolde years ago, I found the upper register to be slightly tinny. If you want a harp with an even tone stick to the excalibur, especially if you want to stick to a professional grade harp. this harp has a very rich sound throughout the range and doesn’t tend to sound strange when switching registers. If you don’t mind a student model the Isolde is good. if you don’t want high playability tension, stay away from the classic model of the Isolda. That one is strung with gut and takes some getting used to. I have never had the opportunity to see the last harp you mentioned however, I have had the opportunity to try a couple of their other 34 string models and have generally found them to be too short even for me. Note, I’m barely 5 feet tall.

[Lily-White]

Hi Blindharpe,

Thank you so much for taking the time to share your experience and all this information.

I’m so happy that you have found the right harp for you!

I don’t think I have ever read anything negative about the Excalibur and your post supported this. It’s definitely a special and very beautiful harp. However, only now I noticed on Camac’s website that they classify it as a heavy tension harp. So unfortunately it’s not for me, my hands couldn’t take it, for health reasons.

The Camac Ulysse remains a mystery, both when it comes to string tension and sound quality. It’s quite strange that one cannot find any comments, reviews or opinions about it.

Anyway, I listened to the sound of the Dusty Crescendo you started with and I loved it! I’m very glad you mentioned it, once again I noticed that there’s something about that “Dusty sound” that appeal to me very much. Bright treble and lots of bass resonance. They have several medium tension harps. The FH36S sounds wonderful and it’s pretty high as well. Not as high as the Excalibur though, I’m 179 cm tall (the converter gives me 5 feet 10 15/32 inches, if that makes any sense. To me it doesn’t… 😀 ).

Ah, I loved that you said: “Don’t be fooled by that label! You can play anything you want to on a Celtic style harp just as you can with a harp that carries the label of classic and has traditional concert spacing!”. This made my life easier… 😀

Thank you once more and enjoy your Excalibur!

– Lily

[Blindharper]

Hi Lily,
Please don’t pick a harp on classification alone! I saw that myself when I was doing harp research years ago. You need to try them for yourself. Sometimes they’re not always. a harp can be classified as heavy tension because of static tension, not playability tension. There are harps that are classified as light tension that I cannot play because the playability tension is too high. So, while the classifications are certainly good, please test run any harp. You’re thinking of getting if at all possible. Don’t make the mistake I did, and pick a harp based on sound alone. Though in your case, I think it would be labels and classifications. now I will grant you that my circumstances are different from yours, but while I loved my dusty strings crescendo, it was not the right harp for me. That harp I picked by research and sound quality alone without actually physically encountering the heart myself. Terrible! Terrible! Move! It ultimately ended up being too short, too wide, and a darker tone than I prefer. If at all possible, do physical test runs, don’t go off of classifications, labels, or marketing brochures.

[Lily-White]

Hi Blindharpe,

Good point, thank you! I recognize myself in what you are warning me for… 😀
It was very interesting to hear about your experiences of tension classifications and playability.

I’m still a beginner, so I guess I also need time to understand what I really want and need. I have some issues with my hands, that I also need to sort out. I’m just so interested and so curious about everything that has to do with harps, that I easily get carried away…

I live in a country that doesn’t have even one harp store, and not a lot of harps / harpists. So it’s a little complicated. But point taken, I’ll keep it in mind! Thank you! 🙂

– Lily

[Blindharper]

If you are able to, it might be worth attending a harp festival. Those are great places to test drive harps. Great place to meet other harpist to. I so much about the harp at least in my experience has been about feel. Does it feel right, does it sound right, does it behave the way you want it to. You should adjust the harp to you not yourself to the harp.
Happy harping,

[Lily-White]

Hi,

That is so wise, and so beautiful! I never thought about it that way, but now that you said it, I agree 100%. Thank you!

Happy Harping to you too! <3

– Lily

[balfour-knight]

Lily, from reading much about the Ulysse model, I don’t think that it would be the best choice for you. It is obviously too short, with you being tall. It also only has 34 strings, and I feel you would want more. It is in large part carbon-fibre, and I have read that you like real wood, as do I. Carbon-fibre is alright when it is used to strengthen parts of the harp, like the neck and column, but it absolutely does not resonate like real wood!

In summary, you need a tall harp with 36 or more strings, with medium to light tension, and in WHITE if at all possible. I will add that I think it should be a pedal harp with light tension. I hope you find this dream harp, and I believe you will, but it will just take some time. I have played the harp since before I was 8 years old, and only in 2015 and then in 2017 did I finally find my two dream harps. (I am 68 years old.) So, good luck, sweet lady!

Harp Hugs from both of us,
Balfour and Carol Lynn

[charles-nix]

Lily, another approach is, for builders who sell directly to the public, like Dusty Strings, contact them and see if they have sold any models in Finland. They might at least be able to contact the owners and ask if they would mind your seeing the harp.

Regarding models, Dusty has a new(er) model that might suit your needs: Serrana 34. Light tension, carbon fiber column (light weight), also closer spacing, but unless your fingers are large diameter (working man sized) or you need to play multiple different harps, close spacing won’t be an issue one way or the other.

[charles-nix]

@Balfour-Knight–of course you know that there are no new light-tension pedal harps, which is really too bad. Might find a restored 19th century, but it would surely be gilded and carved. No reason one couldn’t be built: start with say a Chicago or 85 (or Athena), put in new (much thinner) soundboard, put the column on a lathe and turn it a bit smaller to reduce weight, new neck, finish it all white. It would be expensive–but it could be light tension, pedal, and in white. Probably would still be 55-60 lbs, though; too much steel and brass in the action, rods, and pedals. And then you’d have to have custom bass wires wound for stringing.

[Blindharper]

It is precisely because of the weight classification of a standard pedal harp, that I never tried to learn to play one. Most standard pedal harms way nearly as much as I do. Sadly, if you want to stay 30 pounds or under, you’ll have to stick to lever harps, with, perhaps the exception of the heartland starlight, which is about 38 pounds. Complete the carbon fiber. I was actually lucky enough to meet the maker of these harps a few months ago, and had the opportunity to try his legend harp, which is 36 strings and has a round back. If you are fairly slender, you want to stick to round or stave back. A full square back tends to be rather uncomfortable. Nothing quite like the neck of your harp, jabbing you in the shoulder every time you pull it back to play. Thank God for round backs. my one consistent pet peeve through the years has been a lack of interest in the creation of a harp specifically for a wheelchair user. If you’re short, get a small harp, if you’re tall, get a tall harp, if you have hand strength, yet a medium to high tension, harp, minimal or no hand strength, get a light tension harp. end up in a wheelchair for some reason well… Have fun! Especially if you’re small. A harp for someone in a wheelchair would need to be fairly light without sacrificing strings.

[balfour-knight]

In response to the above two posts, my dear harp friends, Lily desires a pedal harp, white, low-tension, and she has been drooling over a Salvi Daphne. She also says that she needs a “quiet harp” so as not to disturb her neighbors. This could be neatly achieved by stringing the Salvi Daphne with lever gauge strings, which on a normal standard pedal harp are softer, both in sound volume and how they feel to the hands. I bet Salvi themselves would even do this custom lighter stringing for the customer. I have heard of this done by pedal harpists who desire a lighter tension, softer sounding harp, and with success!

Charles, an antique pedal harp, even a single-action one, would nicely “fit” for Lily, too, with light-gauge stringing. Howard Bryan used to rebuild these and advertise them as “easy on the hands.”

Blindharper–One of the reasons that the Heartland Harps are made in the curved body shape is so that the harpist does not have to pull the harp back on the shoulder in order to play it. Dave Woodworth, the builder, has advertised that his curved-back harps are excellent for someone in a wheelchair. He makes these harps right here in North Carolina not far from where we live, so we know him and his harps well. But like I said earlier, carbon-fibre does not resonate like wood, and these harps are just not my “cup of tea.” I fully understand that there is a need for them, however, and Dave has very nicely accommodated to that need, and even had an influence on Camac using the carbon-fibre.

Thanks to everyone for all these great posts! Keep them coming.

Harp Hugs,
Balfour (and Carol Lynn)

[Lily-White]

Hi Balfour, Carol Lynn, Charles-Nix and Blindharpe R,

I have been following the discussion above between you experts. I have done it with great interest and deep gratitude. So many lovely ideas for me, and you even take into consideration the fact that I’m dreaming of a white harp… <3

I’m learning so much from this forum, and meet good and generous persons like all of you… I’m so happy I built up the courage to write here. What a community! <3

– Lily 🙂

[wil-weten]

There are some single pedal harps like those of Riedel or Mürnseer or David. They may (or may not) be of interest to you. These are hand built harps built by European harp builders according to one’s wishes.

[Author]

Posts