Biagio

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  • in reply to: When the chords are above the melody… #228825
    Biagio
    Participant

    ” Many people only want a relatively inexpensive instrument, that they can learn quickly since they don’t necessarily want to play at high level.”

    I’m sure you do not mean a cheap harp Evolene but if I may….if one wants to actually play without frustations one really should avoid the lower cost ones. That is not to say that one must shell out $6000 or more US but as I think everyone here would agree it is better not to start with a lap harp nor with one that is poorly made…of which there are many out there that look good and perform poorly.

    You can expect a decent 34-36 string harp, fully levered, to cost $900-$1500 in materials alone depending on the selected woods and levers. Add on labor and overhead and you are looking at around $3500+/-. In light of that investment, books and lessons don’t cost all that much.

    Edit: WRT expense, it is instructive to know the major cost component’s. For a goo 5 octave fully levered harp they are:

    Levers – $300 to $800 (Lovelands at the lw end, Camacs or Truitts at the high end)
    Soundboard: $200 – $500 (high grade laminate low, solid wood high)
    Strings – $200 – $500 (nylon & SFB vs gut & BFN)

    So…from about $700 to $1800, or around 30-35% of the total cost depending on frame which can vary widely depending on type of wood and so on. Compare for example the Dusty Ravenna 34 at $2145 vs The FH34 at about $5000.

    Here’s the bottom line: You cannot expect to enjoy learning on an inadequate instrument, and an adequate one is a major investment.

    • This reply was modified 7 years, 2 months ago by Biagio.
    in reply to: When the chords are above the melody… #228823
    Biagio
    Participant

    The Irish bards supposedly said about the Harp “Seven years to learn, seven to practice, seven to play.” Of course that was meant for professional bards on the wire strung harp, but it does make a good point, I think: that one must go slowly and be patient with this instrument (or any other, LOL).

    The good news is that one can make beautiful music practically from the first day! That’s what drew me to the harp anyway – so OK I’ll never play like Kim Robertson but I have a lot of fun.

    Speaking of Kim, her book Arranging for the Folk Harp is another worth getting. It is more concise than Woods’ arranging book but I think better in some ways, not least because it walks you through a tune from simple to complex.

    Unlike Woods, Robertson does not throw a ton of tunes at you (nothing wrong about that of course); she uses a selected few to illustrate how one might go from just the melody to a full and varied arrangement.

    Like an etude, so to speak.

    in reply to: Advice on centering stings on an erard harp #228800
    Biagio
    Participant

    It is impossible to say exactly what might be required from a distance unfortunately. Your best bet would be to take it in to a qualified harp maker/restorer for an evaluation.

    in reply to: When the chords are above the melody… #228799
    Biagio
    Participant

    Oh goodness Stardust, you are not “doomed to mediocrity” by any means! Just will need to go as slowly as necessary and study what is available in other books or on the internet. Just keep at it and have fun!

    in reply to: When the chords are above the melody… #228790
    Biagio
    Participant

    Hi Charles,

    Yep, that has been exactly my experience. If one do3s not have a teacher one must a) figure out where the problems lie and b) what exercises will address them. With Kondonassis I find the progression logical and go straight through (and I still use both plus Friou after over ten years when I feel in need).

    WRT Sylvia’s book: it’s still a classic but well to remember that she created that when lever harps were very recently becoming popular in the music scene, pretty much all other instruction was pretty much for classical pedal harps. Hers what pretty much all that was available otherwise.

    In fact, that harp pictured on the cover is a Triplett Axeline with sharping blades, built sometime in the early 70s I think.

    in reply to: When the chords are above the melody… #228781
    Biagio
    Participant

    I tried at first just using Woods’ and on my own. Soon discovered that it was both frustrating and very limiting. One can “self-teach” but that means one must understand what and how to teach! The issue you describe is mainly with technique up there and a teacher can help a great deal.

    Scales and etudes are fundamental if you hope to progress beyond the basics, as I discovered the hard way. I also agree with Charles but if a teacher is simply not available locally there are some good ones who will teach via Skype or similar.

    Bruner, yes, but I would also strongly recommend Friou’s Exercises for Strength and Agility and (if you can understand a little Italian) Grossi’s Metoda Arpa. There are some translations floating around but really the pictures make it self explanatory – or instead get Kondonassis On Playing the Harp.

    You don’t have to practice exercises 3+ hours/day as conservatory students do – but I think that a half hour of scales and etudes during warm up makes a world of difference.

    • This reply was modified 7 years, 2 months ago by Biagio.
    in reply to: Camac Excalibur Vs. Isolde Celtic #228268
    Biagio
    Participant

    I’m glad that was helpful harpfairy. I should also note that when makers refer to “balance” they may be considering something related but rather different i.e. the three basic statistics they look at when designing it: tension, tension divided by vibrating length, and the ratio of tension to breaking point.

    There are others – hardness, diameter, etc. – but this discussion – already somewhat esoteric – would verge near the realm of the metaphysical.

    We plot these statistics as an aid during the design phase.

    Tension is obvious: many, myself included, want to achieve a smooth curve gradually increasing from treble to bass. (Some may not: the Fisher Eiriann has a marked jump at the bass after fairly low tension – it is designed for fast Celtic music with lots of ornaments and good sustain in the bass).

    That would suggest that the resistance to the force of the pluck remains fairly constant There will be less resistance from a longer string than a shorter one which leads me to

    Tension divided by length, which might in that case be a curve gradually sloping down.

    Tension to breaking point is the least intuitively obvious: simplistically we don’t want it so high (tight) that strings break a lot but not so loose that the tone is muddy. In theory the higher this is the more clearly the string will ring; in practice we consider the purpose. A harp such as the Prelude would be pretty high; a harp intended mainly for fast Celtic music would be lower, and a South American harp very low.

    It is not particularly practical for a player to examine these statistics unless he/she really wants to understand more about how harps a designed (although that is not a bad thing if one has the time and interest). Suffice it to say that if a harp is described as “concert tension” that suggests overall high tension and T/L; if for “Celtic” lower.

    Many lever harps are designed to be suitable for a range of styles…at which point one needs to try them out!

    Biagio

    in reply to: Camac Excalibur Vs. Isolde Celtic #228252
    Biagio
    Participant

    What actually does it mean when people say “balanced” sound?

    I can’t speak to what Wil means but from the harp maker’s position…it means that there are no sudden changes in tonal quality. Take a 5 octave nylon strung harp for example: in the lower mid there is a “transition zone” where the strings may need to go to heavier than mono nylon. One strategy would be to use gut, another nylon wound over nylon. The latter would be more “balanced” (gut is more “mellow” than nylon).

    Another area is the bass: many go to metal wound steel core strings there but if the harp is gut strung elsewhere those would sound harsher than fiber core silver wound.

    Some makers and players prefer different tones in different ranges so “balanced” may not be what they want. Dusty is a good example – bright treble, more mellow mid, lots of bass resonance (with bronze core nylon wrap).

    As always, try the harp, rather than rely on another;s experience alone, if possible. Nor are studio recordings entirely reliable; I’ve heard expert players get sounds out of my harps that I sure did not know where in there.

    Biagio

    in reply to: Changing one set of levers for another #228027
    Biagio
    Participant

    Christy makes a good point, which reminds me…..if anyone is seriously considering replacing Lovelands they might consider Rees levers, available from both Robinsons and Musicmakers. Rees need only one screw, like Lovelands, so you could probably not need to drill any more holes; except possibly for a stop (aka “retainer”) for the largest strings. They also cost less than either Truitts or Camacs.

    Not to be argumentative (well, OK, yes but in the interests of clarity): If the old holes are filled with glued hard wood dowels there will not be a degradation in the neck’s strength – in fact it might be slightly stronger. A skilled crafts person would also be able to hide that repair.

    On the subject of “do it yourself” – levers that engage the string from the back of the string such as Truitts and Rees’ are easy to mount – string tension holds them in place while you mark, drill and screw in place. Those like Lovelands are harder to keep in place if you have little experience, since string tension pushes them away from the neck when engaged.

    I suppose it is more feasible for most harp makers to stick with one or two types. However, if there is enough wood below the bridge pins there is no reason not to order a harp that you otherwise like unlevered and mount the lever type that you prefer. Or have someone do that for you – it really is not difficult.

    Biagio

    in reply to: lever harpists’ experience with busking? #228004
    Biagio
    Participant

    Hi Evolene!

    I’m surprised that no one has remarked on this but what the hey, I will haha.

    I’m a very shy person when it comes to “performance” but on the other hand when it comes to just going out and playing for the heck of it – that has been more fun than I would have ever expected!

    In some places you can find a guitarist on every street corner and people just shrug and keep walking. But bring out a harp and no matter how small or how well they play (or not!) people are fascinated. Little kids come up and stare with huge eyes, their parents ask loads of question (“Gosh I’ve never seen but as pedal harp! How much would one like that cost, how hard is it to learn?” etc. etc.)

    And from this shy person’s stand point, it is just wonderful to get out of the daily practice and have fun without worrying how the music will be perceived, and to be honest it’s pretty nice to not have that internal critic whispering over my shoulder (grin).

    So… plan on just having a lot of fun, bring along a small inexpensive harp if you can for people to enjoy for themselves.

    Most of all – have fun!! That’s why it is called “playing” LOL.

    Harp Pusher Biagio

    in reply to: Removing & Replacing the SAME Harp String… #227944
    Biagio
    Participant

    Hi Stardust,

    stringing a harp is sort of like sewing up a hem – it just takes a little practice but you really don’t need to be absolutely precise. If wind up too little or too much, just back up and try again.

    Most harp makers and beginner books give instructions; this one from Dusty Strings is quite good and it’s in PDF ready for you to print.

    https://manufacturing.dustystrings.com/harps/strings

    in reply to: Removing & Replacing the SAME Harp String… #227914
    Biagio
    Participant

    Ideally, when the strings are wound up to tension they should fall at a slight angle back from bridge pin to peg. Assuming those bridge pin grooves are 1/2″ (1.27cm) from the neck that suggests the pegs should project around 3/4″ (2cm).

    What’s more important though is to make sure that the string does not make too steep an angle from the bridge pin.

    Biagio

    in reply to: Experience with Music Makers Belle harp? #227646
    Biagio
    Participant

    The Belle has essentially the same string set as the discontinued Studio, i.e. pretty light. They discontinued the “Gothic 36” because of the issue you mention – tension too high for the pre-curved SB.

    The Belle and Jolie are also lightly strung, the Voyageur is closer in tension to the Dusty FH34/Crescendo/Ravenna34. I know several teachers who choose the Voyageur, Ravenna, or Rubarth Merlin for rentals. Personally I never liked the Studio tension though one teacher I know did – but she bought the kits.

    That’s all I can tell you, hope it is helpful.

    Biagio

    in reply to: Changing one set of levers for another #227645
    Biagio
    Participant

    Re that passage Evolene: I mean that often it is not necessary to remove the string completely and fill the hole left by a Loveland’s screw. With four slots to choose from (Truiit) versus one (Loveland) quite often there will be enough wood for the Truitt and the base will hide the old hole left from the Loveland.

    A professional would probably do as Charles mentioned (take off al the strings, etc), and charge the owner around $2000 for the job. Maybe more.

    Hmmmm….nah, not worth it right?

    in reply to: What to do with an old Aoyama? #227599
    Biagio
    Participant

    If it is otherwise structurally sound, offer it for sale at a reasonable price and some enterprising harper will be happy to put on a new board.

    Biagio

Viewing 15 posts - 286 through 300 (of 1,123 total)