Home › Forums › Harps and Accessories › Looking for info on Lyon & Healy Style 22
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William Y.
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January 30, 2022 at 1:21 am #283369
Harper10
ParticipantHi! I’m interested in learning more about the Lyon & Healy Style 22 harps from the early 1900’s (1915 more specifically). What was the quality like on those? What were they like compared to other models of the time, such as the 23? Was the Style 22 considered in the same high quality as the 23?
Thanks so much!
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This topic was modified 3 years, 2 months ago by
Harper10.
February 1, 2022 at 5:20 pm #283410carl-swanson
ParticipantThe style 22 was the semi-grand version of the 23. Same decoration and gilding, but in a semi-grand size. The quality was excellent.
March 6, 2023 at 11:51 pm #301408cblack
ParticipantWhat year did they stop making the 22? And why? I just got a 22 from 1915 and it is amazing. Is there something special about that era of L&H that this instrument has held up so beautifully? (It was rebuilt in 2006, but it didn’t need a new neck and still doesn’t..!)
March 8, 2023 at 5:47 pm #301458balfour-knight
ParticipantThe craving for 47 strings is probably the reason for the demise of the 22. We have experienced this in our own time, with models like the L&H 85 and Salvi Daphne. They used to be available with 40, 44, 46 and 47 string configurations. Now, only the 40 Petite and the full-size concert 47 are available. At least Camac still makes 44 and 46 string harps along with their 47 models.
Have a great day, everyone!
BalfourMarch 8, 2023 at 9:45 pm #301461carl-swanson
ParticipantBalfour,
There is another reason for the demise of semi-grand harps. From the manufacturing standpoint, there is little if any difference between the production costs of making a semi-grand or a concert grand. But the buying public expects the semi-grand to cost less, virtually eliminating the profit margin for the sale of semi-grands. Because of this, I’m amazed that any harp manufacturer makes a semi-grand harp.
March 9, 2023 at 7:09 am #301463balfour-knight
ParticipantThanks, Carl. I had never thought of that! That means that buying a semi-grand harp is really a great deal for the harpist.
March 10, 2023 at 7:42 pm #301483Saul Davis Zlatkovski
ParticipantThe quality of wood that was available was of the best possible, and the quality of workmanship was high as well. But it also depends on what you expect from a harp. Lyon & Healy has made many improvements over the years, and their harps are much more consistent now. The oldest harps also seem so great because there were periods of much-lower quality as in the 1960s.
March 12, 2023 at 7:18 pm #301500cblack
Participant@william-yardley your post isn’t showing up here for some reason, but I would like to see the photos. Does anyone know how to access old L&H catalogs?
March 13, 2023 at 6:50 pm #301525William Y
Participant@cblack Yes, when I updated the pictures to have the correct resolution, it ate my post, but also wouldn’t let me repost it. I’m not sure if it’s hidden and needs to be approved by a mod, or if something else went wrong. I’ll repost it below; if an admin knows what’s going on, feel free to let me know.
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We have one from the mid-40s, which is supposed to be a good time period (note: while you will find mostly gold harps from this time period, there are also natural Style 22 / 23 being made by the 40s).
I am not an expert on any of this, but as I understand it, with harps being used in settings that needed more projection, and strings got heavier duty, they started needing to use slightly thicker soundboards sometime around the late 30s or early 40s. This means that, while the ones before the mid 30s or so can be amazing, you’re less likely to find one with an intact soundboard than with ones a bit later, especially if modern concert tension bass wires are / have been used. There are also periods of time with necks that hold up better than others.
Interestingly, while I’d always thought of the 22 as “a 23, but smaller”, and had assumed that the former was based on the latter, I have the reproduction of the 1899 L&H catalog that was reprinted in 1979 (hope it’s Ok to share the photos below from it her, and the No. 22 in there looks similar to a modern 22 / 23, but the No. 23 at that time looks nothing like either a modern 23 or 22 – looks like a straight soundboard, the carving is floral, the default column and base have been “ebonized”, and it’s the same dimensions as a 21, so probably smaller and fewer strings than a concert grand. Curious if anyone who knows more about the history has any of the backstory here, or has seen this older style of 23 floating around.
One person told me that the 22 is one of the most varied models (you’ll see two different column styles, same as the 23, and other minor differences in the appearance; there is also a rare “Wagner bust” model).
Attachments:
You must be logged in to view attached files.March 13, 2023 at 6:52 pm #301527William Y
ParticipantPosting these in a separate post, since I don’t want the post to get eaten again.
Attachments:
You must be logged in to view attached files.March 13, 2023 at 6:55 pm #301530March 13, 2023 at 10:43 pm #301531carl-swanson
ParticipantWilliam-I have two of the “Wagner bust models” but I never thought of them as style 22’s. I didn’t know what model they were.
March 13, 2023 at 11:20 pm #301534William Y
Participant@carl-swanson I could be wrong! I have not seen a lot about them, nor have I seen one in person, so this is very much second-hand information. I think there are very few of them, right? Would love to see!
I first heard it mentioned (and referred to as a Style 22) by a tech who is very well informed, and also see a few references to it being a Style 22 on a couple of Facebook posts (one by H Bryan and one by International Harp Museum), but I make no claims to first-hand knowledge.
I tried to link to some photos here, but can’t get them to link (should be findable via a web search, though).
For anyone who’s curious about the older iteration of the Style 23 (the straight soundboard / semi-grand version), I just remembered – there’s one in the Met’s collection that I came acast time I came across this:
https://www.metmuseum.org/art/collection/search/503991
(the image is in the public domain, so I’ll attach a small version of it here as well)Attachments:
You must be logged in to view attached files.March 14, 2023 at 12:09 am #301536William Y
ParticipantA thread from a couple years back that you’re in which also mentions these in passing (this thread may also be interesting to the OP).
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